From: Lynn McIntosh [faiml@uswest.net] Sent: Saturday, October 16, 1999 10:12 AM To: mjanke@miamiferret.org Subject: (Fwd) Adrenal List #21 Forwarded message: From: Self To: @SENDLIST.PML Subject: Adrenal List #21 Reply-to: Lynn McIntosh Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 12:51:56 Adrenal List #21, dated June 26, 1997 1. Hair Loss Other than Adrenal Disease 2. Reply: Hair Loss Other than Adrenal Disease 3. Thanks to Amy Cada 4. Reply: Hair Loss Other than Adrenal Disease 5. Subject: Re: Adrenal List #20, Tippie, Another Rescue, Tennessee Adrenal Panel 6. Adrenal List #20, Zowie 7. Reply: Adrenal List #20, Zowie 8. Ferretwise Adrenal Surve 9. Reply: Ferretwise Adrenal Survey 10. Male ferret "Rambo", castrated -5years old, weight 1450 g 1.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 22:20:30 -0700 From: sterling Subject: Hair loss other than adrenal disease I was thinking about Tippie and so I went back through my years of files on ferret medicine to find other things that cause hair loss. There are a number of things. For tail only hairloss : stress clogged pores The only other disease that I found that causes hair loss is hypoactive thyroid. I am not a vet mind you but this is what I have read and is what I am experiencing right now. This is also accompanied by general lethargy and a tendency to be a bit on the rotund side. Sexual behavior in female ferrets may be the result of an incomplete removal of the ovaries leaving what my vet calls an ovary stump. This can also lead to heat like symptoms and needs surgery to be corrected. (This is apparently not that common) I also wanted to let you know that I came across an article about Gentamycin which is an antibiotic that apparently some vets have used for ECE. This has been shown to be toxic in ferrets and has caused some ferret deaths. You can catch this article yourself in the independent voice archives which you can find at the acme ferret web site. And now a little Question of my own: I intimately understand the ins and outs of adrenal symptomology and the disease itself. But what is it that eventually causes death? My vet said something about bone marrow shut down which seems reasonable but in Lydias case she got sick and died very quickly. (Three days) Literally one day she was fine and the next day she was deathly ill. She had low body temperature but no signs of virus or bacteria. No blockage and a normal x-ray. If I find out more about this I will let you know. I am also trying to find out what levels of Lysodren are fatally toxic to ferrets. Good luck to Tippie Sterling 2. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 10:48:53 -0500 (CDT) From: Amy Cada Subject: Reply: Hair loss other than adrenal disease >disease itself. But what is it that eventually causes death? My vet said >something about bone marrow shut down which seems reasonable but in Lydias case she got sick and died very quickly. (Three days) Literally one day she was fine and the next day she was deathly ill. She had low body >temperature but no signs of virus or bacteria. No blockage and a normal >x-ray. If I find out more about this I will let you know. I am also Sterling, especially in females, those with adrenal tumors have high levels of estrogen and estrogen precursors in their bodies, which is why administering drugs like HCG to bring them 'out of heat' may decrease vulval swelling correlated with it. High levels of sex hormones stresses the immune system and causes aplastic anemia as red blood cells are not replaced at the correct rate, causing lethargy and a fairly quick death. With my own female, we tried to bring down the vulval swelling with hormones, which did not work (tried twice) then went for surgery though she was a poor risk. she has a complicated right which was completely removed along with part of her left and surrounding lymph nodes, all came back neoplastic, so no further surgery was done. however, she did live for 6 more good months after the surgery, so at this point I will always go for exploratory whenever there is some amiss in my guys. I have heard good and bad about Lysodren, but my vet doesn't use it much, so I could not tell you any stats about results or toxicity in my area. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Amy Cada Department of Behavioral Neuroscience, UT Down yonder in Texas!! Terrierists: Asta 2/3 NA, Wylie and Gryphon agility, flyball, go-to-ground, and ratting freak-a-zoids geriatric ferrets: Foster, Farris and Hobbes; Zowie @ RB ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 3.---------------------------------------- From: sterling[SMTP:ster2872@gte.net] Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 1997 10:01 PM To: 'Adrenal List' Subject: Thanks to Amy Cada Amy , thankyou for informing me about aplastic anemia. I was suffering alot of guilt about what more I could have done for her.(though I think everyone second guesses their decisions at the death of a loved one.) Lydia was a very poor surgery risk and she had already had three surgeries for the removal of the left and exploratory for the right adrenal. On the count I am with you , when in doubt go for the surgery. Lysodren did keep her alive about 17 months after they decided the right adrenal was completely inoperable. We didnt suffer any really ugly side effects from the lysodren. It didnt seem to bother her much. Thanks for letting me know. Sterling 4.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 20:31:28 -0600 From: Barbara Gustafson Subject: Reply: Hair loss other than adrenal disease Sterling, How nice to know you've been thinking about Tippie. She is recovered from her surgery and once again is bouncing all around the house. My vet also suggested that her problem may be caused by the thyroid and so she was put on a 6 week bout of medication. I can't recall the name but could get it if required. Anyway it has no effect at all. I suppose it could be stress related, but if so from what? And would it last this long? You pose a valid question regarding what is the actual cause of death in these cases. I wish I could tell you, but I'm afraid I don't know. Anyone else out there know? I'd like to thank everyone for caring so much about Tippie. It's so nice to have people like you to talk to and bounce thoughts and ideas off of. I don't know what I'd to without the support of my Internet friends. Thanks again Barb Gustafson (aka Boots) 5. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 20:44:36 -0600 From: Barbara Gustafson Subject: Re: Adrenal List #20, Tippie, Another Rescue, Tennessee Adrenal Panel Amy, Sorry to take so long responding. Suddenly there are not enough hours in the day. Tippie's only real symptom is the hair loss and scratching and a slightly enlarged vulva. She is full of bounce and energy and a regular nuisance at times. What sort of symptoms did Zowie's ferret have? > Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 08:08:53 -0500 (CDT) > From: Amy Cada > Subject: re: Tippie >Zowie's companion ferret who also got the mystery virus is just now starting > to recover (from many months of the mystery virus) one side effect of which > seems to be hair loss. Has Tippie been sick at all other than hair loss and > scratching? Lisa, Your new rescue Faith is in my prayers, bless you for saving her. > From: Lisaferret@aol.com > Subject: Another rescue > She is also so skinny, I swear you can see thru her - she weighs in at almost > 3/4 pound but so sweet!! I am going to try to fatten her up before attempting > any surgery and evaluate her then for her candidacy for > lysodren/surgery/flutamine. Keep your fingers crossed for sweet little Faith! > > > Lisa To Lynn, Lynn, thanks for your support with Tippie. I've talked to Dr. Dutton about the Tennessee test and will be taking the information to my vet. The FAQ I have say's that if your ferret shows all the symptoms then the test really is unnecessary. I'll have to think about this one for a bit. Has anyone had this test done? How do they draw the blood? From where? I have to brag just a wee bit here. We just recently started an association and shelter here in Alberta, Canada. We got our first shelter ferret in a couple of days ago and quess what? You got it, she's an adrenal ferret. She has massive hair loss and all the signs of neglect. We'll be trying to put some weight on her to get her ready for surgery. No name yet so say a prayer for our little "No Name" Barb Gustafson (aka Boots) 6.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 16:10:29 -0500 (CDT) From: Amy Cada Subject: RE: Adrenal List #20, Zowie >From: Barbara Gustafson >Tippie's only real symptom is the hair loss and scratching and a slightly >enlarged vulva. >She is full of bounce and energy and a regular nuisance at times. >What sort of symptoms did Zowie's ferret have? Zowie had hair loss and a slightly enlarged vulva, which by most standards, is enough proof to diagnose adrenal and go ahead with surgery. Zowie had a bad case of some kind of intestinal bug that put off surgery for almost 2 months. By that time, the cancer in and around her adrenals had spread, but her symptoms had not worsened at all! Except for a little scratching and tail hair loss and the swollen vulva, you wouldn't have known a thing in the world was wrong with her. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Amy Cada Department of Behavioral Neuroscience, UT Down yonder in Texas!! Terrierists: Asta 2/3 NA, Wylie and Gryphon agility, flyball, go-to-ground, and ratting freak-a-zoids geriatric ferrets: Foster, Farris and Hobbes; Zowie @ RB ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 7. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 21:20:13 -0600 From: Barbara Gustafson Subject: Reply: Adrenal List #20, Zowie Amy, Zowie's symptoms sound the same as Tippies, yet now she's had two surgeries and the vet found nothing both times. It's funny cause I almost wish he had found something, at least then I wouldn't be wondering what the heck is going on. He checked her from stem to stern and didn't find any lumps, bumps or otherwise. Barb Gustafson (aka Boots) 8.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 18:30:47 -0400 (EDT) From: ferretwise@top.monad.net Subject: Re: Ferretwise Adrenal Survey For all readers on this list-- I am very curious about a significant increase in adrenal disease as of the past few years at an early age -- 4 years and under. I am starting to gather statistics on these ferrets in the hopes of getting a clearer perspective. I would like to take some responses and start a tabulation list... please complete the following questions and send to ferretwise@top.monad.net Fill in a separate reply for each ferret PLEASE! In subject line type: ADRENAL REPLY Thanks for your help-- I will be happy to supply the results when I have a significan amount of interest generated-- we will probably be quite surprised. Alicia shelter Mom, Ferret Wise Shelter A- have early alter ferret -- who have had surgery for their ferrets with pathology results cofirming adrenal disease & B- after a length of time adrenal symptoms returned and either were diagnosed- or have not had the ferret diagnosed for bi-later adrenal would please email me with the following information. 1. Sex of ferret M/F Was it purchased altered at pet store? Tattoos? please describe / state source of ferret if known from records 2. age of ferret (and date) at initial onset of adrenal symptoms 3. Listing of symptoms exhibited: 4. Date of initial adrenal surgery: 5. What changes did you see in symptomatic behavior after surgery: 6. How long before symptoms recurred: 7. Was ferret diagnosed with adrenal disease of the remaining gland? on what date? 8. Was a treatment opted instead of surgery? If so what? 9. What were the results of the treatment? 10. Was surgery performed to remove the second adrenal gland? 11. What significance was noticed in syptomatic behaviors? 12. Was any additional treatments given in addition to surgery? How long? 13. Is the ferret still alive? 14. How old was the ferret when it passed away? 15. In retrospect -- how do you feel about the treatment protocol which was used? Were you satisified? Would you recommend the same to others? Date 9.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 21:35:02 -0600 From: Barbara Gustafson Subject: Reply: Ferretwise Adrenal Survey > Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 18:30:47 -0400 (EDT) >From: Barb Gustufsan > Subject: RE: Adrenal List #20 (fwd) > A- have early alter ferret -- who have had surgery for their ferrets with > pathology results cofirming adrenal disease > > & > > B- after a length of time adrenal symptoms returned and either were diagnosed- > or have not had the ferret diagnosed for bi-later adrenal > > would please email me with the following information. > > 1. Sex of ferret M/F Was it purchased altered at pet store? > Tattoos? please describe / state source of ferret if known from records Tippie is a female, purchased from a local pet store already altered. She has tattoos in both ears, they look like to lines in each ear. She is a Hagen ferret from Montreal, Canada. > > 2. age of ferret (and date) at initial onset of adrenal symptoms She was one year old when she had her first surgery. She was born Feb 17, 1995 > > 3. Listing of symptoms exhibited: Hair loss on tail. > > 4. Date of initial adrenal surgery: Feb 27, 1996 > > 5. What changes did you see in symptomatic behavior after surgery: None. Hair on tail never regrew. > 6. How long before symptoms recurred: Almost immediately. She started scratching like crazy and within 8 months hair was becoming thin. 7. Was ferret diagnosed with adrenal disease of the remaining gland? on what > date? No. > > 8. Was a treatment opted instead of surgery? If so what? She had a second exploratory on Feb 14, 1997 and again on June 13, 1997. Both times no sign of the disease was found. > > 9. What were the results of the treatment? > > 10. Was surgery performed to remove the second adrenal gland? No. Unable to locate the second gland. > > 11. What significance was noticed in syptomatic behaviors? > > 12. Was any additional treatments given in addition to surgery? How long? > > 13. Is the ferret still alive? > Yes > 14. How old was the ferret when it passed away? > > 15. In retrospect -- how do you feel about the treatment protocol which was > used? Were you satisified? Would you recommend the same to others? I would always recommend surgery whenever the symptoms of adrenal occur. > > > Date June 20, 1997 > 10.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sat, 21 Jun 1997 14:19:39 +0200 From: "[ISO-8859-1] J/rg Drobniewski" To: Adrenal List Subject: Male ferret "Rambo", castrated -5years old, weight 1450 g In december 1996, 3 1/2 years after his castration, the male ferret started marking his territory again; hid body odour did not change. From January 1997 onwards, Rambo's body had been enlarging but his muscles had been suffering from atrophy. On the suspicion of a tumour he was narcotized and his abdomen lanced on 20 February 1997. The fatty tissue in his abdominal region had increased considerably and turned into lumps. We assumed a hyperfunction of the cortex of the suprarenal gland. The operation was finished without removing the suprarenal gland and the male ferret was at once administered "Ketokonazol" (10 mg per kg bodywiThetaight). The ferret started playing again 3 weeks after the operation and his muscles began to build up after 6 weeks. The dosis "Ketokonazol" could be reduced gradually. While administering biotin and zinc, his coat grew well again on his close-cropped belly. Rambo has not been administered "Ketokonazol" since 1 May and he is fine now. Gisela Henke Krowelstrasse 51 13581 Berlin Germany ------------------------End of Adrenal List #21------------------------