From: Lynn McIntosh [faiml@uswest.net] Sent: Saturday, October 16, 1999 10:12 AM To: mjanke@miamiferret.org Subject: (Fwd) Adrenal List #48 Forwarded message: From: Self To: @SENDLIST.PML Subject: Adrenal List #48 Reply-to: Lynn McIntosh Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 19:15:49 Date: Tue, 30 Sep 1997 18:39:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Lynn Mcintosh To: Adrenal Group -- Amy Cada , AndresenK@aol.com, Angel Howse , Anthony.Mastropolo@sandoz.com, beek@feist.com, Beth , "Brian L. Schmidt" , Cat13Dog5@aol.com, Chris & Shelley Knudsen , dadams@dzn.com, Dave and Pam Taynor , Dixie Carter , Diana Ashton , Ela_Heyn@notes.pw.com, Ellen Jensen , ferreton@pond.com, ferretwise@top.monad.net, ferts@telusplanet.net, gabby , Gary Holowicki , Jan3GDFA@aol.com, Jason & Alison Overstreet , JC2109 , "Jeffrey Veiss (CTG)" , Jennifer Skeem , Jennifer_Morlanne@email.fpl.com, "Jerry O. Stern, MD" , Jim Dunn , Joanne Gelormino , Joerg Drobniewski , Juliana Quadrozzi - GA Domestic Ferret Association , kammee@juno.com, "Karen Purcell, DVM" , karen wisniewski , lbarber , Lee McKee , Lisaferets@aol.com, Lorraine Tremblay , lotaweasel , lynda@flinthills.com, MADWAH@aol.com, Margaret Lehman , "Mary L. McCarty" , "Michael F. Janke" , Monica Maples , Pam Franklin , Pam Franklin , Patricia Curtis , Rick Riley , ROCHELLE@art.fss.buffalo.edu, Sburbine@aol.com, sterling , TMccabe453@aol.com, Tobibags@aol.com, TrinaSing@aol.com, Troy Lynn Eckart , "Valori K. Blank" , Vicky James , Vikki Mick Subject: Adrenal List #48 Hi there!!!!! I'm so happy to be back!!! The HIV/AIDS conference I attended for work was very interesting, as was spending a week with my mom... But the VERY, VERY HIGHEST HIGHLIGHT was meeting Adrenal List members Carin Riley and Michael Janke (will write soon!) , and getting a tour of their ferret's club store and shelter! The store "For Ferrets Only" is run by shelter mom and dad Angela and Johnny, an incredibly sweet and talented couple. After visiting the store I got a personal tour of the ferret shelter, where Angela, with her photographic memory, introduced me to each of about 125 ferrets! I met a hugely fat ferret with hypothyroidism, who seemed to take some glee in entertaining us by lying solidly on his big back and squirming about his gargantuan tummy. I met another very fat lady ferret who had swallowed a tube of estrogen before coming to the shelter and, since my visit, has died of cancer :(.... I met a paralyzed (hind legs) fuzzy who got around grandly... a nearly all-bald, very sweet fuzzy... deaf fuzzies, blind fuzzies... a brain damaged fuzzy that was thrown against a wall by a big dog and now runs about rapidly if amilessly but gets to live, bless shelter mom's Angela's heart, because she doesn't seem unhappy... a fuzzy who peed all the time, and has since had emergency surgery and passed away :(..... Some 12 fuzzies, if my memory serves, and it often doesn't, are awaiting adrenal surgery in the shelter, which is very expensive to run... I wish I could have taken them all home! But they are very, very well loved during their shelter stays. Angela tends to them full-time, while Johnny works to support them all. They even have matching accoutrements - blankies, hammocks, tents, etc. - in their myriad of cages that occupy three rooms - accourtrements hand made by Angela! The "For Ferrets Only" store run by Angela and Johnny is grand, too, with a wonderful ferret play area colorfully decorated by Angela. Carin makes great things too (I bought four of her blankets), and Michael gave me a hand-printed, hand-ironed wonderful club tee-shirt. Topped off by a Sushi dinner, this was an evening to remember!! Oh, the shelter went through the worst part of Hurricane Andrew and every fuzzy survived - that's good karma! Anyway, some amazing stories about allergies in today's list. Welcome to the new members, and I'm off to pay some attention to my own fuzz kids. Our furless one, Wally, is in his fourth week of Lysodren and sprouting a little hair! He's never been on Lysodren more than three days (3 on and 2 off) and hasn't had a toxic reaction, but is very playful and energetic. I'll keep you all updated of course! Fuzzy hugs to all, Lynn PS. My first rendition of the visit to fuzzies in Florida was much more entertaining, but instead of sending it, I cancelled it, so this is hastily rewritten, sigh... Adrenal List #48, dated Sept. 30, 1997 1. Faith 2. Gizzies allergic reaction 3. Faith 4. Post: Insulinoma (Rikki) 5. Reply: Post: Insulinoma (Rikki) 6. Lysodren (Molly) 1.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 19:29:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Lisaferets@aol.com Subject: Faith Hi everyone! I just wanted to let everyone know that Faith, the advanced adrenal ferret, had her surgery on Wed. It was determined to be on the right side only ;-( and could only be debulked, because it was completely surrounding the vena cava. She was recovering well, and the good news is that all of her other organs looked good! Barring any major complications, she should be coming home to me on Thursday. I am hoping that she did not lose any of her cute habits, like chasing Ernie (the man of the house) around so that she could lick him, or trying to put me to bed like a kit! Here's hoping that she keeps her cute habits, continues to dook and give kisses, and grows her hair back!! Happy Ferreting! Lisa 2.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 09:12:38 -0600 From: Troy Lynn Eckart To: Adrenal Group Subject: Gizzies allergic reaction WARNING! When giving any medication watch your ferret for at least 1 hour aftewards..... Late last night I gave Gizzie his first dose of Lysodren and not 10 minutes later he had the red ferret allergic reaction. I am so thankful that Gizzie came to me (as they all do when they are sick - it really is amazing). He walked in to the room, looked at me then flat ferreted. I noticed right away his nose was pinker than usual. By the time I picked him up (30 seconds maybe) his nose, gums, and paw pads were bright red! I grabbed the Benadryl and gave him 1/2 cc, grabbed the Dex/Atarrax and sat it on the tray beside me (injectable but only if the reactions cause severe breathing difficulties - to be injected in the thigh muscle) and called the emergency vet number. I explained to Travis what happened and what I'd already done and that Gizzie was breathing o.k. Travis said to watch him closely for an hour and he should be fine. Boy did I watch him closely. The hour went very quickly (you'd think staring at and petting a ferret for an hour would seem to be a long time) and Gizzie JUMPED up and scratch, scratch, scratched. I knew he was o.k. then. He was bright eyed and even played a little. This was Gizzie's first dose of Lysodren. Rule is that they have to be exposed to something at least one other time before they can have a reaction. The Lysodren is cut with lactose - couldn't be that as Gizzie gets goats milk daily with no reaction. Perhaps the base of the Lysodren. Moral - Watch for reactions on all medications, including first doses. Hugs to all. tle 3.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 22 Sep 1997 12:04:29 -0400 From: Lisa_Leidig@ucamp.com Subject: Faith! This is Lisaferets, writing to you from work -- its been such a crazy weekend, that I just had to tell everyone all about it! As you know, Faith had her surgery on Wednesday and stayed overnight. We went to pick her up on Thursday, and the vet said to us, "I am going to go ahead and send her home, but I am a little concerned. She doesn't seem to have much of an appetite, and she isn't very active." So on the way home, I start planning our course of action -- duck soup, meds, etc. I get her home, and place the carrier in the middle of the floor of the "ferret room". I open the door, and here comes Faith, like Secretariat at the Belmont, out of the carrier! ZING! ZING! everywhere, looking for us, smelling the other cages. She immediately starts licking Ernie, and then me, and then runs some more around the room! Then she spies the bowl of Iams on the floor, and starts wolfing it down. Its as if she said, "I'm home! ". She was so active that we had to put her in her cage, as she was stretching her stitches, and causing them to bleed a little. She is currently on prednisolone 2X a day, and Amoxicillian 2X a day. She takes both well, thank goodness. Saturday night, I was getting ready for ferret chat on AOL (10-midnight) and I went to give her the last meds of the day. Now about an hour previous, I had given her her pred. I walk up to the cage, and see in horror, these pink loops hanging from her belly!!! I screamed and told Ernie to get her carrier! I quickly called the doc and told her that "stuff was coming out" (Ok, so I was panicking!) and she said she would meet us at the emergency vet. Ernie, keeping a cool head, said get dressed and find some sterile gauze to hold her insides in. (I was in my bathrobe) I found some sterile gauze and Ern placed it over her wound and held it there securely. I got dressed and we went to the emergency vets. A 20 min drive that I cut down to 15 by speeding and running red lights. Between the two of us, we were a pair -- I had no shoes on, and whatever clothes I could find, Ernie had no shirt on, shorts and flip-flops. We get there and hand the ferret over a tech, explaining what had happened. Dr. Laura pulls up about a minute later and asks to see her. She comes back and says that its not too bad -- they weren't intestinal loops, only the ibecum?sp a layer of fat and tissue that surrounds the intestinal tract. I told her that from my quick look at them, they didn't appear to have been ruptured that long, since they were pink, moist and there wasnt anything stuck to them. As it turns out, what happened was that the type of sutures that were used, Faith is apparently allergic to and her body attacked them viciously. All sutures nowadays are dissolvable, but in 6 weeks not 4 days! Her body had broken down a good portion of the sutures in that short period of time! So she got to spend a night at the emergency vet, all of her stitches taken out, her abdominal cavity flushed and restitched! During her overnight stay, she removed her body bandage twice and then started worrying the area restitched, so she is currently wearing an elizabethan collar made out of an old x-ray! And that is supposed to stay on for the whole time the stitches are in! WHEW!!! So that was our weekend! She is doing fine! I am amazed that with all of the stuff done to her in four days that her energy level is still somewhere near nuclear! Nothing keeps this little girl down! She is now safely ensconced in a single level cage, where her collar is securely fastened. She is eating and drinking like normal and seems to be saying, "surgery???? Nah, nothing to it!" So anyway, I wanted to keep you updated on how she is -- I hope everyone else's weekend was more uneventful than ours! Happy Ferreting! Lisa 4.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sat, 27 Sep 1997 12:28:35 -0400 From: Dave and Pam Taynor To: 'Lynn Mcintosh' Cc: Gary Holowicki , Troy Lynn Eckart Subject: Post: Insulinoma (Rikki) Hi Lynn and list, Unfortunately a not so good post today. Our Rikki who has had two adrenal surgeries to take out his right side adrenal and ligate the vena cava has now been diagnosed with Insulinoma. We were away last week and our pet-sitter noticed Rikki in a coma-like state. He started to come out of it while she was getting ready to take him to the after hours emergency clinic. They found his blood-glucose level to be only 39 and gave him fluids and glucose. He spent the next two days at the vets and came home to the sitter's house for another three days until we could get back. We were away for my father in law's heart surgery and just couldn't get back back any sooner. Rikki seems to be doing ok now. I have talked to three different vets however and have gotten 3 different opinions. One vet said to make sure he eats every few hours and give him something sweet to bring him out of another coma or seizure. A second vet said there is nothing that can be done, that Rikki is almost out of time. The third vet wants to operate and take out any tumors he can find and told us to give Rikki Karo syrup three times a day, especially before bedtime and before leaving for any long period of time. In the FML's medical FAQ someone mentions using drugs to regulate the blood sugar level. I would really appreciate anyone who has gone through this to let me know what they did. I hate to put Rikki through another surgery so soon. He had one early March and one early May. He is 5 1/2 and is a little slower than our younger ferrets, but in good spirits and eats and plays fine. I hate to think he went through all the adrenal problems only to succomb to this. Has anyone dealt with this long term? Thank you for any info. Pam Taynor mom to Rikki Tikki Tavi 5.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 30 Sep 1997 11:33:23 -0600 From: Troy Lynn Eckart To: Dave and Pam Taynor Cc: Gary Holowicki Subject: Reply: Post: Insulinoma (Rikki) We use Pediapred and proglycem to control insulinoma as well as diet. Here is our Insulinoma handout. Let me know if you have any questions. Hugs and healing wishes. tle Insulinoma Information What I've learned about Insulinoma - I've learned that we need blood sugar for our brain to survive and function properly. When we don't have adequate amounts we see the symptoms the ferrets exhibit, pawing at the mouth (this can be from other illnesses or food caught too so don't panic here), drooling, gazing off, hind end weakness, drunken walking, seizures and ultimately when left untreated - coma and death. A simple blood glucose test should be done twice, at least 3 weeks apart. The Insulinoma secretes excess insulin which eats up the blood sugar before it reaches our brain. Insulinomas are normally found in the pancreas and they are so tiny, about the size of a pinhead I'm told, they are often times difficult to find by an inexperienced vet. Many times even when the Insulinomas are surgically removed there are more later. Prednisone (PediaPred is for human babies and is much more palatable so your vet will need to call in a prescription to your local pharmacy) causes more secretion of glucose and Proglycem (diazoxide) is an insulin blocking agent. Brewers yeast is thought to be beneficial in that it is a good source of Chromium which is important for normal sugar and fat metabolism. A high protein diet and frequent meals are especially helpful. What works for one ferret may or may not work for another. First we have to get your little one eating. When he/she doesn't eat the blood sugar plummets. Pick up a can of Vanilla Ensure Plus, Sustical, Boost, Resource Plus, or have your pharmacy order Deliver 2.0. These are all human nutritional supplements and lactose free so they should not cause diarrhea. There are also generic versions of those I listed and they are fine too. At the health food store buy a can of Brewers Yeast Debittered. This is different from baking yeast. Don't buy baking yeast. Brewers yeast is a brown powder. You can sprinkle brewers yeast into a bowl with the Ensure or whatever you choose or mix it with linatone or nutrical. At the grocery store buy a box of Gerbers oatmeal baby cereal and a can of Soybee baby formula (or similar lactose free) and a bottle of plain pedialyte (generic is o.k. too). .5 can Deliver (or whatever you choose) 1/4 cup Pedialyte 1 scoop Baby formula 2 teaspoons Brewers Yeast 1/8 - .5 cup Oatmeal baby cereal Stir till well mixed. Warm a small portion, about 2 ounces (the size of a small baby food jar - these work great to store for individual servings and they are very inexpensive at 2nd hand stores. Small tupperware or similar types of containers work well too). Warm in separate container than what you feed in. Stir well with your finger to check for hot spots. If still hot blow till luke warm. Store remainder in fridge and reheat for each feeding. Feed 4-6 times a day if possible in addition to allowing them free choice at their regular food. Other ferrets in the home can eat this, it won't hurt them and is probably good for all. To get him/her to eat you may have to dip your finger in the recipe and smear it in his/her mouth a few times. Then you have to figure out how he/she wants to be fed, by spoon, lapping it up, you holding him/her and the platter (small saucers work best), your ferret sitting on a tv tray or table or counter on a towel and eating on its own, or by syringe feeding. To syringe feed a 12 cc (no needle) syringe works well and your vet can sell them to you (about 50 cents each). Gently drip the recipe into either the front or side of mouth, not in the back and be careful not to force the tip in. You don't want to put it directly down the throat because this could push fluids into the lungs. He/she will let you know if you are going too slow. If he/she has a low sugar attack rub Karo syrup or honey on gums. This rushes sugar through the system. Now for PediaPred - Divide the dosage into 2 times a day. If using Prelone liquid (tastes nasty), pull the amount up into your syringe then suck up the recipe to fill the syringe. You will need to give the Pred everyday, but with my Whitney she lived for 2 years on Pred and Proglycem. Whitney's dose of Prelone was .2 two times a day and she weighed 1 3/4 pounds. Your vet can adjust the dosage to weight of your ferret. The side effects of Insulinoma are much worse than the Pred. Proglycem is given once a day. It is also a human baby medicine. It is very expensive but works well in combination with the pred. It can take up to 3 months to regulate. Hope this helps. 6.---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 30 Sep 1997 10:57:51 PDT From: Diana Ashton Subject: Lysodren (Molly) Hello All, Finally, some good news. Molly, my Adrenal ferret is showing some signs of improvment. We started her on the Lysodren about a month ago. Labor Day weekend to be exact. It was a battle getting the med in her. She would take .50ml of pred 2 hours before the Lysodren to help with her sugar level. I could mix that with ferretone and avoid the medicine syringe. But the Lysodren was another story. It was a horrid battle even using the syringe to get it in her. She would start to drool so badly that we were both covered with ferret slime and Lysodren. The pharmacist was using a cherry flavor in a water soluable suspension. I called to see what options we had because the sides of Molly's mouth now were bleeding any time i gave her the meds. I informed him that her first love was ferretone so when asked what was in ferretone he said that he would try to suspend the Lysodren in Cod Liver Oil, Soy bean oil, and Wheat germ oil, the principal ingredients in ferretone. Well gave her the dose of the new mixture this morning and while she wouldn't take it by itself, mixed with a little ferretone, she lapped the whole dose up without the aid of the syringe. Hurrah!!! She is also beginning to grow back some of her hair and her vulva swelling is down about 1/3. For other Lysodren babies who have problems with the meds, have your pharmacist try the mixture that we did, it certainly makes med time much less stressful!!! Sincerely and Love to all fuzzies and their Families, Diana ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com --------------------End of Adrenal List #48-----------------