From: Lynn McIntosh [faiml@uswest.net] Sent: Saturday, October 16, 1999 10:12 AM To: mjanke@miamiferret.org Subject: (Fwd) Adrenal List #49 Forwarded message: From: Self To: @SENDLIST.PML Subject: Adrenal List #49 Reply-to: Lynn McIntosh Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 19:16:10 Date: Tue, 7 Oct 1997 23:19:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Lynn Mcintosh To: Adrenal Group -- Amy Cada , AndresenK@aol.com, Angel Howse , Anthony.Mastropolo@sandoz.com, beek@feist.com, Beth , "Brian L. Schmidt" , Cat13Dog5@aol.com, Chris & Shelley Knudsen , dadams@dzn.com, Dave and Pam Taynor , Dixie Carter , Diana Ashton , Ela_Heyn@notes.pw.com, Ellen Jensen , ferreton@pond.com, ferretwise@top.monad.net, ferts@telusplanet.net, gabby , Gary Holowicki , Jan3GDFA@aol.com, Jason & Alison Overstreet , JC2109 , "Jeffrey Veiss (CTG)" , Jennifer Skeem , Jennifer_Morlanne@email.fpl.com, "Jerry O. Stern, MD" , Jim Dunn , Joanne Gelormino , Joerg Drobniewski , Juliana Quadrozzi - GA Domestic Ferret Association , kammee@juno.com, "Karen Purcell, DVM" , karen wisniewski , lbarber , Lee McKee , Lisaferets@aol.com, Lorraine Tremblay , lotaweasel , lynda@flinthills.com, MADWAH@aol.com, Margaret Lehman , "Mary L. McCarty" , "Michael F. Janke" , Monica Maples , Pam Franklin , Pam Franklin , Patricia Curtis , Rick Riley , ROCHELLE@art.fss.buffalo.edu, Sburbine@aol.com, sterling , TMccabe453@aol.com, Tobibags@aol.com, TrinaSing@aol.com, Troy Lynn Eckart , "Valori K. Blank" , Vicky James , Vikki Mick Subject: Adrenal List #49 Hi there. Just a short list today, except for my windy tome, what's new?! ... that it's actually posted to the list... Fuzzy hugs, Lynn Adrenal List #49, dated October 7, 1997 1. Moni Juice 2. Rikki's insulinoma 3. We finally got our right adrenal kid! 4. Wally: Lysodren reaction? Debulking right? Ligating? Replies 1. Date: Wed, 1 Oct 1997 22:43:39 -0400 (EDT) From: JC2109@aol.com Subject: Re: Adrenal List - Noni Juice Hi everyone, I just wanted to thank the people who posted the information on the Tahitian Noni juice. I am sorry I can't remember their names. I have a five year ferret with a tumor in her right adrenal gland. She had surgury to remove the left gland about a year ago. When she showed symptoms about five months ago of another tumor, my vet put her on Lysodren. For the first couple of months the Lysodren seemed to slowing the rate of hair loss, but it did not reduce the vulva swelling. After that she really started to loose a lot of hair. I read about the Noni juice about a month ago. I ordered a bottle and started giving her a few drops almost every day. I still continued giving her the Lysodren. After two weeks her hair started growing back and the swelling went down to almost normal. She now has thick short hair on her neck and underside and the swelling is still down. I am still continuing to give her the Lysodren in case it just took a long time to start working. However, I really feel it was the Noni juice that improved her condition so quickly. The company I ordered the juice from has a web site with all of the information on how to order it. You can search on Tahitian Noni juice to find it. Thanks again for the info I am thrilled that Ali is doing so much better. Louise 2. Date: Sat, 4 Oct 1997 18:00:15 -0400 From: "Michael F. Janke" Subject: Rikki's insulinoma Pam, Angela, our shelter mom, tells me she keeps insulinoma ferrets going for 2 to 3 years on an extremely simple recipe and prednisone. The second vet you mentioned doesn't seem to be well informed, from the sound of his prognosis. The recipe, as I said, is pretty simple. 1 can of A/D, 1 jar of Gerber's 2nd stage chicken or turkey and 2/3'ds of a baby food jar of water. Mix well and store in the fridge. Draw this into a 25cc syringe and feed 3 to 4 times a day. Oh, don't forget to warm it first. A few secs in the microwave or set in a glass of hot water for a bit will do it. Be sure to test the temperature. If Rikki will take more than 25cc's, that's fine too. If he'll eat it on his own, that's a plus, and if he's eating his regular dry food, you might be able to lower the amount of the recipe he's given. You'll probably hear all kinds of recipes. I don't know which is best but the important thing is that he eats well and gets plenty of protein. While I'm here, I'd like to introduce the newest member of our family. While at the shelter today scrubbing cages, litter pans, what have you, my arm was twisted into taking home Cocoa. Ok, so it didn't take much twisting. :-) Another list member and member of our shelter brough Cocoa to the shelter I understand. (thanks Carin!). He's three months old and appears to be nuclear powered! I haven't had a baby since 1986 and I forgot how much energy these young guys have! So far, his interaction with Beasley appears to be going good. Beasley just sits there and watches this blur go by and wonders what the heck it was! He seems really baffled, but at least they don't fight... yet. It should be a long time, and hopefully never, before we'll have to deal with adrenal problems in Cocoa. Glad you enjoyed your visit to our store and shelter, Lynn! It was really great to meet you and I hope you didn't max out your credit card in the store. :-) Mike 3. Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 19:38:07 -0400 (EDT) From: ferretwise@top.monad.net Subject: We finally got our right adrenal kid! It's not always an easy choice with the shelter kids--at least not for this shelter Mom. Sometimes a misdiagnosis ends up being good (as Judith found out last week) -- when you find out it is wrong anyway -- here it was almost a death sentence. Finally, Frank Jr. has gotten the medical attention he needed. After expediting him in his failing state Sunday to Brockport Animal Hosp., Brockport NY!-- Thank YOU Dr. Allen Edwards!! And THANK YOU MARY - for meeting us part way! Today Frank underwent exam, blood work, x-rays and surgery. What a surprise he would have in store! Doc Edwards found the following: decaying rubber in his stomach (2 vets stated after x-rays there wasn't any ((and instead he received an unneeded splenectomy previously and then nearly hemorrhaged to death from a vein that was not tied off properly - a second surgery was performed hours later to remedy that)) he is on ulcer meds to help heal the sores in his stomach from the decaying rubber material, ALSO he has gall stones - this was detected by the second vet, who was at a loss for a treatment.... Frank's gall bladder was left intact as it is healthy and --(the least of his problems), he also was found to have abscesses from ligatures acquired from the previous surgery (splenectomy) AND the unexpected was found - Frank Jr. also had a right adrenal tumor -- it was into the vena cava -- and the removal was via ligation-- so we are now praying that this kid-- who has been able to eat NOTHING except nutrical for the past 4 weeks will make it through the night. This has got to be a million dollar ferret. He will hopefully be able to earn his keep by dooking and dancing after this is all over!!!! What a way to enter his fourth year of life! Please keep your thoughts positive for this special Ferret Wise shelter oldster!!! We hope to have him home in short order. And if you get a chance PLEASE thank Doc Edwards at Brockport Animal Hospital for making time in short order. He has once again saved a kid that was in real trouble. We sure can't say enough good about him. Frank T will be rooming with our special kid Gabriel for the next few days after he recovers from this -- final surgery... HI GABRIEL!!!! Alicia A tired, but somewhat relieved shelter MOM 4. Date: Tue, 7 Oct 1997 22:53:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Lynn Mcintosh > Subject: Re: Wally: Lysodren reaction? Debulking? Ligating? A bunch of replies... On Tue, 7 Oct 1997, Lynn Mcintosh wrote: Hi there. Wally has been on Lysodren since Sept. 3 of this year, three days on and two off. He's been spry and happy, even getting a little fur regrowth on his back. But the last three days haven't been so good. He had been lapping of the Lysodren, emptied from a capsule, mixed with ferretone. We ran out of ferretone ONE DAY and mixed it with nutrical, which he lapped with some trepidation (and I had some too). Next day Lysodren mixed with ferretone was a bust and had to be given with a syringe - sigh! We blew that one! Janos didn't think he looked too well on Sunday, so gave hive a pred. tablet (we were precribed these to give every other day or as needed, and we've been using them sparingly). On Monday he refused cantaloupe - a real bad sign as Wally is abslutely convinced that the cantaloupe in the fridge is pining after him as he is it - absolutely crazy about it! Today I came home from work about 4 pm, opened up the ferret townhouses and about 4:30 out came Wally, running but stumbling, his back legs giving way. I went to him and stroked him and he relaxed, but looked tired. I offered Karo syrup (refused), then nutrical and catalope (refused). Then he began running about and vomiting up white foamy stomach acid, poor little guy. I called Pam Franklin, whose Oreo ended up in the ER after a week on Lysodren (first dose), a couple days off, and beginning Lysodren again (Oreo is now doing grandly and Pam watches closely for when to back off the dose, and Oreo gets pred. as well though I don't know how often). And I called Wally's vet. Wally has also had diarrhea for two or three days, on and off, and today his runny stool was black and shiny, which we think may be caused by the liver cleaning out toxins (dying adrenal tissue and the Lysodren itself). Anyway, the vet said to give Wally prednisone today and tomorrow morning and back off the Lysodren (also to take him to the emergency clinic for a dexamethadone shot if he gets worse, and to bring him to her tomorrow if need be). We gave him the pred., and has also had a good amount of water and some chicken soup, all of which he's kept down. He refused cantaloupe though! (I think he may somehow now link his beloved treat to Lysodren, but we'll see). I'll offer him more turkey soup before retiring, and some water. He's been getting turkey soup on Lysodren days, but we'll begin giving it to him daily, as he's lost three or four ounces since starting the Lysodren. I'm glad we don't live in a cold, cold climate! Any suggestions or commiserations would be very much appreciated. We would like to see our Wally again cavorting around soon. He'll be off Lysodren for a bit until he shapes back up. I just hope it's the Lysodren and not his huge tumor growing larger. DEBULKING. To recap, Wally had exploratory surgery done in early August. A huge tumor was found and a needle biopsy analyzed by two different pathologists pointed to adrenal tissue (though there wasn't enough tissue to determine anything else). Along with a high estradial and hair loss and itching, we've determined he has an adrenal tumor and are treating for it. Has anyone seen or heard of a tumor so encapsulated with the vena cava that not even a biopsy could be taken (only a needle biopsy)? Each time Wally's vet touched the tumor with her scalpel she said it began oozing and she was afraid it would began bleeding. No debulking, obviously, was done either. I'm asking because I've never read of a ferret going in for adrenal surgery and having an adrenal tumor (that wasn't involved with other organs) completely inoperable. It appeared not to have affected other organs, but was so large my vet wasn't sure it was adrenal (tubular and between golf and racketball-sized). LIGATING. We're looking into the possibility of ligating the vena cava, but this is taking some time, and we're hoping the Lysodren will begin helping in the mean time. Vena cava ligations have been done at this clinic (for adrenal tumors), but not with a tumor of this size. Thank you for listening and sorry this was so long! Lynn McIntosh and the Gang of Seven sweet fuzzies (always in spirit, Percy, Shcroedee Boat, and Squeeks with his neural-tube newborn siblings) A BUNCH OF REPLIES > From: Lisaferets@aol.com > Subject: Faith > and could only be debulked, because it was completely surrounding the vena > cava. Hi Lisa. What a story about Faith's stitches causing an allergic reaction and dissolving way too soon! You and SO sounded like you made a cute pair ;) at the ER clinic. I hope Faith is well on the way to recovery. > From: Troy Lynn Eckart > To: Adrenal Group > Subject: Gizzies allergic reaction > This was Gizzie's first dose of Lysodren. Rule is that they have to > be exposed to something at least one other time before they can have > a reaction. The Lysodren is cut with lactose - couldn't be that as > Gizzie gets goats milk daily with no reaction. Perhaps the base of > the Lysodren. Hi Troy Lynn. Did you find any other base that worked? Or what caused the allergic reaction? > Date: Sat, 27 Sep 1997 12:28:35 -0400 > From: Dave and Pam Taynor > To: 'Lynn Mcintosh' > Unfortunately a not so good post today. Our Rikki who has had two adrenal > surgeries to take out his right side adrenal and ligate the vena cava has > now been diagnosed with Insulinoma. We were away last week and our > Rikki seems to be doing ok now. I have talked to three different vets > however and have gotten 3 different opinions. One vet said to make sure he > eats every few hours and give him something sweet to bring him out of > another coma or seizure. A second vet said there is nothing that can be > done, that Rikki is almost out of time. The third vet wants to operate and > take out any tumors he can find and told us to give Rikki Karo syrup three > times a day, especially before bedtime and before leaving for any long > period of time. In the FML's medical FAQ someone mentions using drugs to > regulate the blood sugar level. Pam, how is Rikki doing and what did you decide to do? Michael: I just wanted to say that I'm so glad that you got a new fuzzy, Cocoa and gave him, one of those many beautiful fuzzies in the South Florida Ferret Club and Rescue shelter, a wonderful home, and I hope he gets on famously with Beasely. And, yes I did overspend at the For Ferrets Only Store! But at least I knew it was going for a good cause, and I've really enjoyed the spoils, as had wayy, who selected the wonderful round fuzzy blue bed I bought, with Carin Riley's pink blankey inside as his recovery spot. Alicia, I hope Frank Jr. is hanging in there! (And you too...) Please let us know how he is doing. Fuzzy hugs as always, Lynn ------------------------End of Adrenal List #49-------------------